Tenkara in the Wind + Idaho TU

0:00This is Daniel Galhardo and you're listening to the Tenkara Cast, the podcast about the simple Japanese method of fly-fishing, Tenkara. In the Tenkara Cast, I'll be sharing information with you on techniques, history, gear and philosophies, as well as Tenkara stories from anglers all over the world. This podcast is brought to you by Tenkara USA, introducing Tenkara outside of Japan since 2009. It is only possible we create content such as this podcast and all the videos that we create because of your support, so we thank you so very much for purchasing Tenkara USA rods, lines, and flies. I hope you enjoy learning more about the simple Japanese method of fly fishing, Tenkara. The first part of the Tenkara Cast these days is going to be where I give you some information about Tenkara. Today's topic is going to be how to fish within cutting the wind. The second part of the podcast today is going to be a conversation with Trout Unlimited.

1:04And today's guest is going to be Kira Finkler. Kira is the director of the Idaho Water Project and as well as the Western Water and Habitat Program for Trout Unlimited. So she oversees a lot of the big projects going on out in Idaho and as well as several parts of the western part of the United States. So she has a really good overview of everything that's going on. and Trout Unlimited of course is the main non-profit organization that really cares for our watersheds and trout habitat so CARA's work as well as that of of course of all the volunteers at Trout Unlimited really is what allows us to fish in a lot of waters and allows waters to thrive and sometimes to be recovered and that kind of thing so I thought it would be important to to start highlighting the work that Travel Unlimited does around the country. TU is organized via chapters, you know, so they do have chapters around the country that cover their local issues. And that's what I want to bring to you, just the work that they're doing in your area, finding, as well as trying to figure out how to get you involved, you know, inspire you to become involved with TU or become, at the very least, become a member.

2:17If you're listening to this podcast, there's a very good chance that you fish. There's also a very good chance that you're fishing some of the waters that TU has worked on. So before I go any farther, just a little shout out again. Go to tu.org, take a look at the work that they're doing. If you haven't become a member, do become a member and find ways to become involved. And they do really good work. And TU, or Trout Unlimited, is always the main beneficiary for Tenkara USA. So 1% of all of our sales go to environmental organizations. TU is always the main beneficiary. So that's it about them for now. And if you want to skip to the conversation with Kara Finkler at Idaho TU, I'm not going to be offended. you can skip to the 23 minute and 45 second mark and you can listen to our conversation about TU and the water projects going on in Idaho in the western part of the United States. So let's talk about fishing with tenkara in the wind. That's a question that comes up very often and it's not going to be a particularly long part of the episode because there's a few tips that I want to share with you a few ways that I usually approach windy conditions. But the reality of it is that wind just sucks. Regardless of what kind of fishing you're doing, if the wind is strong and it is consistent, it's just kind of tough. So we all kind of fight the same battles, but there are a few tips that will help your tank out of fishing when it comes to wind. So let's talk a little bit about the equipment first and then I'll share some techniques. When it comes to equipment, let's talk about the rods first. So the rod, you know, like it's going to be the rod that you have in your hand. So that is going to be a little bit harder to change. But just keep one thing in mind.

4:20If you are casting against the wind, the longer or the more rod you have exposed to the wind, the more wind resistance you're going to have. So the rods that are a little bit thinner and the rods that are shorter, they're usually going to have much less resistance to wind. So I want to point that out because, you know, if you do have like, oftentimes I have the Ito in my hand and oftentimes it's windy. It's also a very flexible rod, but it's our longest rod. When I'm fishing with the Ito, it does have a fair amount of wind resistance. So I kind of have to be aware of that, that there are a couple of tricks that you can use, but it's going to have much more of a wind impact in terms of casting than a shorter rod and a thinner rod like the rodo, for example. So with that in mind, keep in mind that if you are fishing in certain situations and you have especially one of the adjustable rods, you know, like the rodo, the sato, or the ito, which you can adjust to different lengths, when you have the rod at a longer length it's going to have more wind resistance.

5:29So right now I'm going to be talking a little bit about casting and you know how to how to deal with the wind when you're trying to get your fly somewhere. In a couple of minutes I'm going to talk a little bit about how to deal with the wind in terms of the actual fishing. So if you have the ito in your hand or if you have the sato or the roto and you're starting to kind of find that you're struggling a lot casting with the wind or against the wind I should say, try fishing the rod at a shorter length. So that's tip number one for today. Try adjusting the length of the rod. Now let's talk a little bit about the other part of the equipment that we have which is the line. Certain lines are going to cut through the wind better than others and there's a few different characteristics you know that we're looking for. first of all would be the weight of the line. So you know some very light level lines they're gonna be even though they're thinner diameter they're much lighter so the wind can blow them around a little bit more easily. So heavier lines will typically cast against the wind better than lighter lines. Now the lines that we currently carry you know we have two different lengths of taper lines for the new nylon lines. The new nylon taper line casts really well against the wind.

6:52It's got just the right amount of weight that it kind of punches through the wind really well. It's also not a very thick diameter line, so it casts really nicely, and it's got just enough stiffness that it kind of just punctures the wind, if you will, a little bit better. now the other lines that we have at Tenkara USA there's the traditional taper line that we've carried for many years those tend to have a good amount of weight to them so you can they kind of punch you know like out nicely but they tend to be softer and they have a thicker diameter so the wind can pick them up a little bit better and then when it comes to level lines we do have them in three different weights, 2.5, 3.5, 4.5. Not to be confused with any kind of Western fly fishing weight classifications. These are specifically weights designated for tenkara lines. But suffice it to say that the heavier line, the 4.5, is going to cast against the wind much better than the 2.5. The 2.5 has other advantages. When you don't have any wind, it's going to stay off the water more nicely. With that being said, if you have the option or if you're fishing and you're finding that the line is not punching through the wind, just ask yourself, which line is this?

8:10If you are using a super light 2.5 or if you're using one of the traditional taper lines, there's a good chance that that line is going to be your limitation when it comes to wind. If you have your new nylon taper line that we sell at Tencut USA, that cuts through the wind pretty well so it's um it's probably not one of the main limitations so that's it about the line i think that i wanted to mention you know just kind of how the interaction between the line and the wind is going to be next is going to be the fly same thing the heavier the you know the bigger the fly you have uh the more resistance to wind it's going to have um so if you have a you know just a little regular tank kind of fly, those tend to be very aerodynamic actually, because they reverse hackle and low profile and that kind of thing. So those are never a problem with wind themselves. If you're trying to cast a larger fly, like a stimulator kind of fly, those will be picked up by the wind a little bit more. So keeping those things in mind. Now that I kind of give you an overview about how the equipment is going to interact with the wind, let's talk a little bit about techniques and how to actually start fishing with the wind. First, I'm going to talk about casting, and then I'm going to be talking about just how to present the fly.

9:36When it comes to casting, if the wind is strong and it's consistent, the first thing to keep in mind is don't fight it you know because regardless of what kind of setup you're using casting against the wind is just never going to be very pleasant you know it's always going to be a little frustrating there are ways to deal with it i'll get into those in a second but if the wind is consistent and it's strong don't fight it use it what i mean by that is, you know, oftentimes people tend to have one approach to fly fishing. They either go upstream or they go downstream. I'm a big believer that you can go either way. And if I'm fishing and the wind is blowing downstream and I'm trying to cast upstream, well, why don't I just change my tactic here and start fishing downstream? Or, you know, if I'm fishing a kind of an open meadowy kind of stream and it's blowing across is there any way that i can cross the river and use the wind to my advantage to carry the fly out for me so you can use the wind in a lot of situations that i've seen to actually get your fly where you want it to go of course you know like sometimes there's gust of wind sometimes the wind changes you know sometimes it just kind of seems to kind of wreak havoc and that's something that we're going to deal with and there's no easy solution here. We just all deal with the wind. We all cuss it. Nobody really likes wind. But first suggestion that I have is try not to fight it. Use it. The second part of it is going to be how to actually cast against the wind. So people are actually often surprised by how I can actually cast very accurately, even against fairly strong winds. And there's two main things that you need to do when you're actually fishing and you want to cast your fly against the wind. So, you know, let's say there's a really good spot and it's a little upstream from you. The wind is being kind of consistent, but you really want to get your fly out there. In terms of casting against the wind, first thing you're going to do is you're going to have a much faster cast, especially on your forward cast. So typically when I'm teaching people how to cast, you know, I tell them go faster on your back cast and that's going to make the line just going to have more speed and then it's going to make the line load your rod. And then I usually tell people on a forward cast, you can go slower. You can relax your hand. The rod is going to do most of the work for you.

12:14Now, when the wind is coming against you, you have to fight it. So what you're going to be doing is you're going to do a fast back cast and a very fast forward cast. Fast, fast. So the, you know, like right now I've got a rod in my hand here and you know, like the, the speed that I'm actually talking is the speed that I'm moving my hand. So fast, fast, fast, fast. So that's back cast, forward cast, back cast, forward cast, uh, and use your wrist, you know, cause the wrist, wrist is actually going to help you with that. So speed is fundamental to get you to cast against the wind accurately and precisely and just really efficiently as well. The next tip is where to kind of move your rod to and from. So the typical Tenkara Cast, you know, you're going to do your back cast and you're going to stop the rod pointed straight up at 12 o'clock approximately. On a forward cast, you're going to stop it at 2.30 or, you know, 10.30 kind of position depending on which side of the clock you're looking at. Now, when I'm casting against the wind, I'm going to modify it a little bit so that I'm not going to go as far back on my back cast. So I'm going to stop a little bit in front of me. And essentially, I'm just going to have a little less time to kind of play with the wind, essentially. So I'm going to stop the back cast a little bit sooner. And then my forecast i'm actually going to stop the tip of the rod really low almost parallel to the water almost at three o'clock and what i'm trying to do is get the line to shoot towards my target closer to the water where there's going to be a little bit less wind so that's how i personally deal with the wind when i want to cast against it and another kind of little variation of this this modified casting stroke is to do a sidearm cast.

14:15So I just mentioned that, you know, you can do an overhead cast, and that's what I do most of the time on the forward cast. I'm going to stop the rod tip lower, closer to the water, and it's going to take advantage of that last area with the last wind close to the water. If you do a sidearm cast where your rod stays essentially parallel to the ground or to the water, that can also help a lot. So if you're having some problems with the wind and you're doing the overhead cast, go ahead and try sidearm cast. Oftentimes that can help a lot because it just kind of stays where there's less wind. So that's kind of how you cast against the wind, how you deal with it. But again, just to recap, rule number one, don't fight it. if you do have to fight it just make a very quick casting stroke and have your rod tip closer to the water either at the end of the cast or during the cast if you do a sidearm cast but actually that just reminded me of a third little tip that I share oftentimes or I don't usually share it because I haven't thought too much about it but when you're fishing and the wind is kind of a not super consistent and no it's not completely blowing non-stop take advantages of little pauses in the wind to get your fly where you need it to go so that's actually something that i use really often i'm in front of a pool the wind is kind of i'm noticing that the wind is mostly there but there are pauses in the wind take advantage of those so take a breather you know you see a rise don't cast to it immediately you know it's actually going to help you because it's going of give the fish a chance to kind of go down recuperate wait until you have the little pause in the wind and then cast so that's another way to deal with the wind as well now i talked about the equipment how to cast against the wind but one of the more common questions that i get is actually how to fish against the wind so typically that comes from the fact that most of the presentations that we do with Tenkara are where we keep the rod tip kind of high and the line off the water. Now, when you do that, when the line is off the water and it's windy, the line is going to be picked up by the wind. So if the wind is blowing towards you, it's going to just kind of drag your fly towards you. If it's blowing away, it might start making the fly kind of flutter above the surface instead of staying in the water so how do we deal with that um first probably the main thing is it's actually pretty much everything stems from this is minimize how much line is exposed to the wind and so here's we're gonna you know it's never really a rule to keep the line off the water entirely it's it is the way we fish most of the time because we can prevent any drag drag on the line, but nothing tells you to keep the line off the water entirely all the time.

17:20So if the wind is blowing kind of strong and you're having a hard time because the wind is picking up your line and blowing it, minimize how much line you have in the water. So what you're going to be doing is, I usually avoid doing what I call a Western fly fishing presentation. I usually avoid casting the line straight in front of me across the stream, laying the line in the water because that's just going to drag it a bunch. What I usually like to do is primarily have my rod tip upstream from my fly or upwind from my fly if I can. But what that's going to allow me to do is if you visualize for a second here, you have a stream in front of you and it's flowing from your left to your right. Now, let's say that you do your typical presentation and you Keep the rod tip kind of elevated, line is off the water. Now the wind is blowing from your left to your right as well. So it's blowing from upstream to downstream. If you do that, the fly is just going to be dragged by the wind downstream really fast.

18:23It's going to kind of skate over the water and it's going to get off to water and so forth. Now try this next time you go fishing and just visualize this in front of you right now. instead of having the rod tip pointed up point the rod way upstream and almost have the tip the tip of the rod touching the water now if you just keep that there for a quick second what's going to be happening is the line is going to the fly is going to just move downstream you know and then you have your tip of the rod close to the water upstream from the fly and the line is taut. It's really nice and tight and you're essentially dragging the fly that way. Now if you want to do a dead drift, just start moving the rod downstream with the tip of the rod pointed down. If you want to do a pulsating kind of motion, it's a little bit harder but you can do just do the pulsating movement with the rod going towards upstream for example. So you can start doing all these different techniques just by having the rod tip upstream from the fly and the rod tip really close to the water. That way you're minimizing how much line is getting picked up. So that's kind of like really the number one tip, maybe the only one that I have in terms of how to fish in the wind. Sometimes it just sucks. Once in a while it's just really hard to deal with it. Repositioning yourself is probably the second thing that I would suggest.

19:55If you're, let's say, on the tail end of the pool, you know, like you have the same stream in front of you going from left to your right, you're on the right side of it. And the wind is just kind of blowing your line, you know, like downstream and away from that pool, and you're really having a hard time dealing with it. What would happen if you just move to the head of that pool? You know, would you be able to just do what I just mentioned a second ago, keep the rod tip a little upstream from there, and then you're fishing ahead of the pool and the line is not getting picked up as much? Or can you cross the stream and fish from the other side? So repositioning yourself to allow ways to keep the line off the water will help you a lot. So a lot of this stuff is actually very intuitive in a way, if you don't overthink it. You know, if you're just trying to solve a little problem uh how do i keep my fly in that lane without the wind uh damage you know like pulling it away too much and typically you can find a solution okay if i position myself on the other side or if i position myself downstream or upstream i can probably do that so that's kind of how you're mostly going to deal with it and in terms of repositioning oftentimes keep in mind that But if you just follow the stream a little bit, maybe the next bend is going to have a nice shelter from the wind.

21:20It's going to have some wind breaks like some trees. Or you go around a bend and the wind is all of a sudden not going from a certain position. It's going from a different position relative to the water. So that can help you a lot as well. so if you're struggling a bunch of the wind and it's just you cannot really think of much else to do move and that's the main advice that we give to think out in general if you're not catching fish move gradually move and find your places where the wind is not going to be blowing as strongly in some places i fish like i i should probably have opened by mention that i do fish in windy places very frequently in Wyoming and the canyons here outside of Boulder and pretty much always find places where the wind can be a little bit more favorable to how I want to fish it. So I've had places like, you know, big open meadows that, you know, there's no wind breaks, but by going around a band, I can find places where I'm using the wind instead of fighting it the whole time.

22:28So that's kind of how I usually deal with the wind. So that's it for the wind part of the conversation that we're having here today. And if you have any tips, any suggestions, any advice, I'd love to hear them. You can share your tips on this podcast page. There's a comment section. If you go to tenkarausa.com forward slash podcast, you can make a comment. And people can learn from you as well. I'd love to hear what you do when it becomes windy. So next up, we have a conversation with Kara Finkler, the director of the water program in Idaho, and she is involved with a lot of different water projects and Western Water and Habitat program as well. So Kara is going to give us a really good overview of what's going on in Idaho. Thanks for listening. And until next time on the Tenkara Cast.

23:32Well, one kind of cool thing just to let you know real quick, we had a family reunion in Idaho last month. And Kevin and Isa came and we had family come from all over and several of them wanted to try fishing. And so Kevin and Isa took them out one evening and they used tenkara rods. They used a couple of tin car rods and a couple of regular fly rods, and they made it so that everybody caught a fish. I was so impressed with them. I mean, I think they're going to be future guides. That is so cool. I love those stories. It's some of my favorites for sure. Yeah. So, Kira, tell us, what do you do with Trout Unlimited? Sure. So I am the director of the Idaho Water Project for Trout Unlimited, and it's part of a larger Western water and habitat program that Trout Unlimited has. And essentially, my team and I work on different projects around the state, oftentimes partnering with farmers and ranchers to improve fish habitat or water flow, often through win-wins. So we might help a rancher upgrade their infrastructure for watering fields, for example, but then at the same time, maybe figuring out a way to put in a fish screen or saving some water to keep it in the stream. And so everybody's benefiting from something like that. We also work in with collaborative groups across the state. So as many places around the West, there's more demand for water than there is supply in many of our watersheds. And so Trout Unlimited has found that the best way to kind of address those, the gap between those two is in collaborative groups where you get every all the different water users at the table and try to figure out um collaborative solutions um to you know maybe not everybody will get all the water that they wanted but everybody will get what they need um and then just we've just found that working together is the best way to kind of find lasting solutions um to those water challenges and um then we also work on kind of related to the conservation projects work on water transactions which just means any way that you can try to keep a little water in a stream or river so as i mentioned before it might be something like keeping a little bit of water in a river through a water lease for example which is basically just a short term um we can um find funds to to pay a farmer or rancher to keep a little bit of water in a stream at a particularly important part of time of the year for a particular trout or salmon or steelhead.

26:39Excellent. So you're based, are you based in Boise or where are you? Yes, I'm based in Boise, but we have staff all over Idaho. And I know, so you mentioned that you're in the Idaho Water Project as well as the Western Water uh, in habitat programs. Um, are you primarily involved in Idaho project or is it, um, you know, Western waters in general or. Right. No, that's a good question. So, um, I'm, I primarily focus in Idaho, but, um, as you know, uh, you know, watersheds don't always, um, stay within a state boundary. So closely with, with some staff in, in other States and then also So some of our staff and even some of our chapters now are their territory covers, you know, more than just one state. So and when I mentioned the broader. So we're part of my my program is part of a water, the larger Western Water and Habitat program. And so there are people like me in the other Western states as well.

27:44So we're all trying to, you know, further Trout Unlimited's mission in these similar ways in the different states. Yeah, no, that makes sense. Yeah, the water flowing from one state to another. I would imagine there's a lot of bureaucracy as well and a lot of challenges that come with that interstate. Sometimes, for sure. And what are the what would you say, like if we focus a little bit on Idaho today, what are some of the main challenges that Idaho is facing that TU is working on? I would say climate change is a big one because primarily because climate change kind of makes, you know, all the stressors that a system is already under, for example, wildfire or drought, you know, climate change just overlays all of those challenges and makes everything more more difficult. So I would say that's one of the challenges. Another challenge is water is water quantity. But, you know, and that's probably tied back to climate and climate change, because, you know, as as things are getting warm, warmer, you know, we just have have less water available.

28:58And that, of course, you know, trout and salmon and steelhead, they need water every day. So that's that's a challenge. And then I would say, too, just trying to broaden our circle of having kids and teenagers and college students interested and excited about fishing and conservation. Yeah, and I kind of, at least for us, I mean, we always look at kids because we want to get them to fish so that they pay attention to what's going on. And last year, I remember introducing a young neighbor into fly fishing. And actually, it's three years ago now. And then it was last year. There was, like, some drought kind of issues. And we were a little afraid that we're going to be very low on water. And, you know, and she was like, hey, like, is that going to be impacting the fishing? Wow. And I was interested to see how that kind of resonated. Right, right.

29:59Yeah, they are very smart. And they pick it up very quickly. um hopefully i feel in in idaho in particular we have amazing volunteers who work on a lot of different programs to help introduce um young people to fishing and um and and the work that trout unlimited does in fact the the ted trueblood chapter that's based on boise this is the ninth or 10th year that they, they, they actually put on every summer, a, um, a trout camp where they take a group of kids, about 20 kids, um, fishing and camping for about four days. And, uh, you know, it's kids everywhere from who have been fishing since they were, you know, one year old to kids who have never picked up a rod before. And by the end, everybody's caught a fish and everybody is happy and it's just it's an incredible um i think outreach opportunity yeah so you know like of course we all know that the western part of the country tends to go through a lot of periods of drought and uh you know california notably right now colorado kind of looks like we might be entering a drought is uh but i don't hear a ton about idaho how is the situation right now in terms of drought conditions and water levels? Sure. So, so last year, um, uh, like other places, we had this incredible water year. We had a lot of snowpack, a lot of snow. And so then we had a lot of water. In fact, there was flooding in some parts of the state. Um, and so there was a lot of, because of that, there was some carryover water in some of the reservoirs. And so even though this year wasn't like that exceptional water year because of some of the carryover it was still a pretty good year this year um and everybody uh there was uh not not anything um severe about about water shortages um so past two years have been okay but it could um you know it's So year to year, it could change next year.

32:08And I, yeah. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. I was going to say, yeah, the Western is fickle when it comes to the water. That's exactly. Yeah. And you sent me a list of projects that you're involved on, and I'm actually going to be posting the links to those several projects on the podcast page for this episode. But what would you say is the primary project, the one that is taking the most time out of your, uh, out of your daily work with you? Oh, that's hard because that's like saying, who's my favorite child among three kids? Um, well, I, I think, um, you know, one, I would, one area I'd mention is, is the upper salmon, um, in Idaho. So fish, you know, historically salmon and steelhead, you know, we're talking about 850 miles from the Pacific Ocean, and they would come back to the Upper Salmon Watershed. And there's an incredible collaborative group of state, federal, nonprofits like us doing restoration projects there, trying to improve the habitat and the water flow for the salmon and steelhead who do come back. And we have a great project manager there named Matt Green.

33:31And also Cassie Wood is working in the Yankee Fork, which is another close by. Also, I sent you some information about that place. And so it's very, it's easy, I feel like it's easy to get depressed when, you know, you're thinking about fish and the, and, you know, water supply and drought and everything in the West. But when you see that this work that my colleagues are able to accomplish with partners, it's very, you know, it just gives you hope that we can, we can improve the situation and keep making positive progress for the fish and for the communities. No, absolutely. And, you know, usually when we see the result, that's very encouraging and we see any little any little victory goes a long way exactly exactly and uh you know most of these episodes i've talked to different chapters of tu uh you know they're more like local chapters you're in a broader scoping uh part of tu and your uh your work is there any way that people that are passionate about water issues in the west is there any way that they can volunteer that they can get involved what is the best way for somebody to get involved with the work that you guys are doing. Sure. So I would say, so we have, um, nine chapters around the state in Idaho and, and incredible volunteers here. We have about two, 2000 members statewide and they're organized into nine chapters. Um, and I would recommend getting involved with your local chapter because actually staff like myself and my colleagues, um, we work very closely and coordinate with our chapters and volunteers and so that's a great way to start working with with everybody here that makes a lot of sense yeah that yeah it seems to be very easy to get involved you know just go to your local chapter and start going to meetings and see where you can add value where you can land your expertise and your energy seems like that's the way to go Well, excellent.

35:41So just kind of, you know, this conversation with TU chapters and parts of Trout Unlimited are really to give a good overview of TU's work in protecting fish habitat, you know, the waters that we love. Through Tenkara, we're introducing a lot of people to fly fishing, and we want to make sure that people are aware of the work that TU is doing. So I appreciate you taking a little bit of time just to give a great introduction hopefully get people interested in the work that you're doing and either donate to Trout Unlimited or go to chapter meetings and start becoming involved so hopefully you're going to see a little bit of a interest from Tenkara anglers on that side. That's wonderful thank you so much for all of the support that you give Trout Unlimited and for introducing so many people to fly fishing. No of course yeah we're so happy to be able to do that and yeah thank you So I appreciate you having on board and we'll be posting this episode pretty soon where more and more people learn about the work you're doing.

36:42Great. Thank you.